Company of Heroes: Eastern Front

Author Topic: Ostheer Doctrine Concepts  (Read 3091 times)

Offline lonesoldier84

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Ostheer Doctrine Concepts
« on: January 13, 2010, 04:53:45 AM »
One option:



Doctrine = Panzer Support Style


-----------------------------------

Left Side:

FIRST

1CP: Motorized Medic


cost = 75 manpower

description: unit rides onto the field as a controllable unit. it has a special ability that costs 25 munitions each time with very short cool down. The ability is called "retrieve wounded" and when activated your bike goes on a mad dash for wounded infantry and picks them up very quickly once it gets there (the guy in the sidecar jumps out, grabs em, gets back in). The bike then rushes back to base and drops off that man into a new squad of grenadiers. Each time the bike returns he will return the wounded to that unit. Bike will be auto- targeted by enemy as would any other vehicle.

balance: cheap, but very weak in terms of armour. will retrieve wounded from areas where there is no longer much action taking place.

SECOND

3 CP: Panzer Pak38


cost = 375 manpower

description: Pak38 mounted onto halftrack. useful if shortage of early fuel and muni as a vehicle counter. M8's hate them.

balance: when shrecks cost too much and you cant tech to kriegs barracks

FINAL

5 CP Jadgtiger


cost = 2000 manpower

description: god damn, its a Jagdtiger!!! AHHH RUNNN!!!!!!!

________________
__________________
_)_________________

Right Side

FIRST

3 CP: ADGZ Armoured personel carrier


cost = 450 manpower

description: stat wise is a halftrack with better armour. better inf protection from mortars/flames/etc, and much greater speed on roads and packed dirt, although slower in serious off-roading than HT's. Vet3 ADGZ's are tough to kill as they are so quick.

SECOND:

2CP = Sturmtiger


cost = 600 manpower

description: the german AVRE.  works the same. only more german.

FINAL:

5CP = Panzer Support Call-in






cost = 900 manpower

description: similar to the american off-map combat group. reinforced with 4 vehicles. vehicles will be an assortment of panzer III's (infantry support tank), brummbar's (anti-tank as well as anti-inf.....but you have to choose which ammo you want to load into the gun...each will cost muni per volley tho less than the avre), and panzer pak38's. you get 2 of one and 1 of the two others. It is randomized.

 ;D

Post Merge: January 13, 2010, 04:54:34 AM
another option:

Doctrine Concepts:

Luftwaffe Style:

Left side:
------------------------------------------


FIRST: 1 CP

-aerial recon squadron (3 x Focke Wulf Fw189)

-cost 100 muni
-description: 3 recon planes fly somewhat randomly and erraticly but reveal a considerable portion of the map over which they fly.
-balance: can get this ability early and reveal enemy tactics early. but 100 early muni is tough to give up. mid-late game with abundant muni is offset with the fact that planes are very lightly armoured and fairly slow. They can be shot down fairly easily (though not guaranteed to go down).

SECOND: 3 CP

- junkers 87 Stuka divebomber

- cost = 150 muni
-description: single stuka divebomber makes single bombing run directly on enemy vehicle indicated. It is possible to dodge the bomb, but the stuka will adjust its attack vector slightly to compensate.
-balance: area of effect is fairly small, but AP is great. cost is reasonable.

FINAL: 6 CP

- Junkers 89 squadron

- cost = 325 muni. average respawn (unlike the V1)
-description: medium altitude bombing. 4 junkers each drop a fair sized payload over an area the size of the terror firestorm. The damage done is GREAT to buildings, inf, arty, vehicles, tanks.
-balance: @ 325 muni you cant do this very often. With scouting from aerial recon, base bombing is very effective but tough @ 325 muni. ouch.


Right Side:

FIRST: 2 CP

-Veteran Falshirmjaeger


-YES!! I love these guys. German paratroopers FTW!. dont change a damn thing about em.
- cost = 375 manpower
-FG42 upgrade cost = 75 muni
-hit the ground with single offensive and single defensive veterancy.

SECOND: 3CP

-Close Air support
-time and area of effect ability

-description: Messerschmitt Bf 109 strafes with canons and small ordnance (rockets/small bombs). the small ordnance is a bit inaccurate, but decently effective vs tanks, and vehicles. infantry get clobberknocked tho if they feel the full brunt of it (although damage is usually spread fairly evenly throughout the sector as the aircraft makes repeated runs of the area). the aircraft will aid in a given sector. this sector can be held by the enemy or friendlies. line of sight is necessary.
-cost = 200 muni
-balance: similar to allied strafing and bombing run put into one. not so quick to pin as the strafing run. not so quick to kill as the bombing run.

FINAL: 4 CP

-ME262 interceptor


-description: enemy aircraft will be hunted and shot down by super-quick jet plane ME262. the ability will see an ME262 making occassional runs over the map for an extended period of time. enemy aircraft will be hunted and shotdown. If they do survive, their accuracy will be greatly reduced.
-cost = 100 muni
-balance: this is a cheap ability. it is fairly effective. it has a long time frame in which it is active. it is used during an extended offensive that is infantry based most often to ward off enemy strafing runs. Why so many CP? because it is so god damned awesome!!! death to the strafing run!! vet 3 grenadier + vet 3 Falshirmjaeger FTW!!!!!!!

Post Merge: January 13, 2010, 05:04:40 AM
P.S. my understanding of most these units is that they were used often enough to see action in CoH.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2010, 05:04:41 AM by lonesoldier84 »

Offline Voop_Bakon

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Re: Ostheer Doctrine Concepts
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2010, 07:27:35 AM »
Lets just go down the line with this one.

I will be rating each idea on a scale of 0-5 Volks

Motorized Medic: Good idea in theory, but I dont think something like that could actually be added.

2 out of 5 Volks

Panzer Pak38: Always nice to see a new unit idea. Need to clarify its role and why its good if fuel and mun is low since tanks usually cost fuel

4 out of 5 Volks

Jagdtiger: How can you go wrong?

5 out of 5 Volks

ADGZ Interesting idea for a halftrack, but to me it looks like an armored car that can carry troops, so it might need some balance work.

3 out of 5 Volks

Panzer Call in: Seems a bit overpowered in my opinion. Try and limit to 2 tanks total and some infantry.

2 out of 5 Volks

Panzer Doctrine: The entire doctrine is call ins, which is not how it should be. You need some munitions munchers in there. Try and limit to 2 or 3 at the most call in units per doctrine.

2 out of 5 Volks
__________________________________________________

Recon planes: Interesting idea to make it random, but revealing more of the map. I like the twist, though it seems a tough buy.

4 out of 5 Volks

Stuka Divebomb: Love the idea, period.

5 out of 5 Volks

Junker 89 Squadron: Looks like a super beefed up bomb drop, perhaps too much. I would replace it with something more original, but it is still good creative thinking

3 out of 5 Volks

Veteran Falshirmjaeger: Just because you like them doesnt mean the Ostheer need a better version of them. Self indulgence + reusing a unit directly =

2 out of 5 Volks

Close Air Support: Seems to be a combination of all airstrikes in the game. After the creativity seen with the Stuka and recon planes, it seems you just needed a filler here.

2 out of 5 Volks

ME262: Seen this idea a lot and in my opinion is too situational to ever be worth using a doctrine slot. Your take is not very different from others, and so it doesnt avoid my opionion

2 out of 5 Volks

Luftwaffe Doctrine: Here you have the opposite problem. These are all very expensive on munitions. Need to add some original call in units

3 out of 5 Volks

Overall: You have good ideas, you just need to organize everything better. Adding some global effects (like terror zeal or HEAT rounds) would help lessen out your overemphasis on only call in/ only abilities. Keep the ideas rolling, your doing a good job


Offline Aouch

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Re: Ostheer Doctrine Concepts
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2010, 01:02:44 PM »
Panzer Doctrin:
I like the idea of the medic-moped, but the wounded-thing is very difficult in terms of animation and gameplay-wise.
The rest is just overpowered shit. Sorry, but that's what I think. Jagdtiger was never used on the EF, same for Sturmtiger. (Except Warsaw, but that doesn't count!)
Your strange looking "Panzer PaK 38" was only a prototype, the AGDZ wasn't even German and only used in small numbers (> 50) as "armoured police car" for SS.
Last but not least, the Panzer call-in might seem fair, though Brummbär was never used intentionally in an anti-tank-role.


Luftwaffe Doctrin:
Recon plane is fine, though I like the "Storch" better.
StuKa is a must-have, so no argueing here.  ;)
Bomber-squadron: No! Why, you ask? Simply because you mentioned base-bombing, which is just lame and noobish.
FJ are already part of the PE. Sure, I would like to see them on the EF, but copy'n'paste isn't cool, you can do it for PzIV and Panther, cause they're units which are really needed and a must-have, but for the rest, we'll have to find better ideas.
Strafing run is so uncool and from time to time even ruine the whole gameplay, so you get a clear NO from me.
Me262 is ... meh! Besides it was never really used, the whole "killing-everything-so-I-won't-lose-any-units" is just dumb.  >:(

Seriously, you can't just but all things together to get you the best Army in CoH. Think about fighting against, not with them, first.

Sorry if that sounded a bit harsh, but a think about it a moment and you'll come to the same result.  :)
« Last Edit: January 13, 2010, 01:07:58 PM by Aouch »
In memoriam MrScruff
The Wehrmacht in the East

Obstheer FTW!

Offline Ryousan

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Re: Ostheer Doctrine Concepts
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2010, 02:29:12 PM »
Well I must admit you have some interesting ideas but...well lets say you are using vehicles that were almost never used in any front, perhaps many people will disagree with me...but there must be a quote of realism in the Ostheer.

We cant just include any tank or assault gun we came up with just because they look cool. I would love to see the Kugelpanzer in action but its just inrealistic. Before proposing something do research, find out how many of the vehicles were produced, when and where they saw action...etc.

As for the copy paste thing, I had the same problem with my first Ostheer concept, but I just matter of time. Take your time to imagine an army, design both positive and negative traits, make it special and different from the Wehrmacht and the Panzer Elite and thats it...besides the process can be fun as hell ;)
My Ostheer Concept Updated: August 26, 2010

http://easternfront.org/forums/index.php?topic=4099.0

Offline GeneralSatan

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Re: Ostheer Doctrine Concepts
« Reply #4 on: January 14, 2010, 03:54:40 AM »
Here's an idea: Instead of a return of the falsimjagers, why not implement a version of the Waffen SS elite Adolf Hitler division? Plus, they were used during the defence of Berlin in '45

Offline Ryousan

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Re: Ostheer Doctrine Concepts
« Reply #5 on: January 14, 2010, 04:32:13 AM »
Having the Falschimjagers back would be cool, the thing is to make them different from the Panzer Elite Falschimjagers. New abilities, new weapons, new traits, whatever you want!!!

Its impossible to make a Luftwaffe Doctrine without those guys.
My Ostheer Concept Updated: August 26, 2010

http://easternfront.org/forums/index.php?topic=4099.0

Offline Unr3aL

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Re: Ostheer Doctrine Concepts
« Reply #6 on: January 14, 2010, 02:44:51 PM »
I see only units, no another things which are normaly in doctrines.

http://easternfront.org/forums/index.php?topic=2904.0 - How should look Ostheer to be original

Offline Loupblanc

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Re: Ostheer Doctrine Concepts
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2010, 12:00:08 PM »

 I am completely against the aerial interdiction. On the spot.
 If anyone had aerial interdiction, it would be the allies. And
 they are not being changed. Plus for 100 mun you kill the
 soviet IL2 strike, soo... no, no, no.
 
 I love the Storch recon runs, though :)
 Stuka strike is straight taken from Codename Panzers, lol.
 The German bomber strike, though, I am completely against.
 He-111 mebbe, but 4 engine german bombers?? No way.
 LOL.

 Gustav strike, perhaps :)

 - I didn't see a Wespe in there. No wespe, no deal :)
You know, there are many people in the country today who, through no fault of their own, are sane. Some of them were born sane. Some of them became sane later in their lives. It is up to people like you and me who are out of our tiny little minds to try and help these people overcome their sanity