Rank ideas!

[UeArtemis]

I propose to correct rank mistakes (icon, names of ranks) and use this (my) table and use Collar Insignia for the Panzer Elite (Waffen-SS).
And I propose textured the PE as the Waffen-SS and use some more realistic texture (not "full-realistic") of infantry for Wehrmacht.
In my table most ranks correspond to each other (look at colours).
Also, I suggest to replace the T17 to Stuart with a machine gun. It is more historical.

I have useful links about ranks
http://www.secondeguerre.net/media/insignesaxe/me_insignesss.html
http://www.secondeguerre.net/media/insignesaxe/me_insignesallemands.html
http://dalefranks.com/wwii/
...

[BurroDiablo]

I fail to see the point in this... we're not modifying other factions or the Insignia/Names of the other factions Ranks. Anything other than the Soviet Union (and Ostheer when we get there) is nothing to do with us.

I'm sure we'll look into changing the Soviet ranks to more historically accurate versions and names, but that's only if its possible to get them integrated (which we aren't sure of at the moment)... currently, these are still in the works.

[UeArtemis]

You know: to change text and some icons is quickly, not a lot of work.    
Do not make "thrash"!

If you do not correct mistakes, then why do you will use historically correct things? If you keep mistakes, you can use fictional ranks! And this is wrong!

And I think that better is creating a Japanese faction, than one more German. The Japanese can be similar to the PE and has a lot of light vehicles, but not heavy.

P.S. The table in "Idea1.doc"! Look at it.

[luz777]

I'm sure this mod was never intended to be completely historically accurate anyway, and will fit in as an "unofficial expansion" better because of it. And I doubt the majority of CoH players either know, or really care that much about the exact ranks and insignia of the Red Army..

Isn't it a pretty forgone conclusion that the Japanese will not be featured in this. Partly why its called the "Eastern Front" mod. Besides, weve already seen evidence of new Ostheer units like the Elefant, and ideas for the Ostheer have been discussed quite a lot in the suggestions area recently.

Cheers

[nbeerbower]

Well that's the thing he's not talking about the Red Army ranks. He's talking about modifying pre-existing German factions.

But will there be ranks for the Soviets?

[BurroDiablo]

We've made ranks for the Soviets, but the problem is getting them into the game (for a custom faction).

[vengefulnoob]

Look, I'm part of the pacific team and we're making the ija. This team has slogged it's guts out trying to make a realistic eastern front expansion without any tutorials. Look to our mod for the Japanese, but for pete's sake stop asking this team for the Japanese, let them get on with their work. From the pacific team, we're amazed at the work you guys have done and we wish you luck for initial release.

About ranks... Good to here you are trying to put them in, but I have a point about the commisar and the major on the moddb page. I know they're old pics, but I think that they should be reversed, since the commisar model looks like a highly decorated soldier, while the major looks somewhat like a commisar, just a personal opinion

[BurroDiablo]

The Commissar certainly looks more like a Commissar than the Major does. The Major looks more like a Lieutenant General in Winter dress and the Commissar seems to have the medals of a Captain, but its not a massive deal, we're not aiming for extreme historical accuracy right down to the colours of the lapels, we're aiming for entertainment... we're not going to loose sleep over a few tiny inaccuracies. =

[UeArtemis]

If I have time, I will make right icons, but I don't have time
There is no extreme historical accuracy, you have no historical accuracy at all.

Other version is in Idea3.doc.

[BurroDiablo]

No historical accuracy? Oh yes, because in this mod the Russians are fighting Australian Jedi's sent from the centre of the sun.

Christ, a few dodgy looking Ranks and suddenly everyone thinks this is set in a parallel universe. Please stop being so nauseatingly pedantic.

[UeArtemis]

Do not forget about your inverted epaulets and guardsmen with bandages, conscripts and regulars, T-90...

But I think if mod will be made by the Relic we have something like this:

1. Efreitor
2. Junior Sergeant
3. Sergeant
4. Senior Sergeant
5. Starshina
6. Podpraporshchik
7. Praporshchik
8. Senior Praporshchik
9. Junior Lieutenant
10. Lieutenant
11. Senior Lieutenant
12. Captain
13. Major
14. Podpolkovnik
15. Polkovnik
16. Brigade General
17. General-major
18. General-lieutenant
19. General of the army
20. Marshal

It is sad

[Zerstörer]

I think it's time you understood that the historical accuracy in the mod is to the same levels as the rest of COH/TOV.
We cannot and will not get stuck to what is actually a pointless 'selective hard core historical accuracy' debate.

Hard core historical accuracy is not what the COH game and the mod is about! The game and the mod is about cinematic action and and factions that offer a gamer nice tactical and fun options to play the game.

We use inspiration(key word!) and ideas from what the soviet army used in ww2, but that in no way means that we'll try and make them as they were in ww2. Why?..cause this isn't a hard core ww2 simulation game.

So, please step out of this hard core midset and make suggestions that are compatible the the mod's goals instead of ranting about hard core historical accuracy of how the red army really was in ww2 etc.

[UeArtemis]

It isn't "hard core". The Relic keep some historical realism and their "historical mistakes" need for political correctness and balanced gameplay. I think that your the Red Army isn't on a Relic level of historical accuracy.

[Zerstörer]

I firmly believe you're wrong on this and i will simply make some small comparisons to your main complaints regarding historical accuracy.

-'Guards' having the arm band is what your complaint is about. 'Guard'  was a honoured bestowed on combat formations who had proven their battle worthiness and which from then on received better gear/tanks/ammo etc than standard formations.
-Knight's cross-they're dressed like juftwaffe pilots with a leather jacket running around with MP44s. Since when did knight's cross holders picked to form elite units in the German army?-bollox historical accuracy. but guess what..they made them that way to create a distinctive looking unit they wanted for game purpose!

T-90- only a couple of prototypes made and used

M-26, less than 2 dosen saw action only in the last 14days of ww2!!
Sherman crocodiles. 4 were used in europe and lost shortly after the landing
Pz4J with a short gun and side skirts? Never existed!
Yeah that's alot different to having t-90s...not

No, we are just as 'historically accurate' as relic if not more. You simply have a specific idea of what you think the soviet faction should look like and prefer 'selective historical accuracy' and that seems to blind you to what the team is achieving here

[UeArtemis]

As I say: The Relic keep some historical realism and their "historical mistakes" need for political correctness and balanced gameplay.
I think they chose all right.

Some gameplay roles exist in game:
Builder
main infantry
Scout car
Sniper
Mortar
Machine gun
Armoured Personal carrier
Light Armoured Vehicle
Anti-gun
Medium Tank
Anti-infantry Vehicle
AT-Tank
Doctrinal squad
Heavy doctrinal tank
...

Do you use this scheme? M26 saw first battle in February of 1945... end of the war was in May...  Sherman Crocodile and Stubby are ideal for AI-Tank role.
Yes, in WWII were about 20 of T-90. 20 prototypes are a great number for the dying Reich, but negligible for the Union.
What is yours Scout Vehicle of the Red Army?
You haphazardly (unsystematic) added units and add vehicles. There are no Scout Vehicle, Armoured Personal Carrier, is a lot of heavy armour and infantry squads, irregular units (Partisans).
   
I would like to help you as a gamedesigner and a historical consultant, and with some 2D graphics, but now I am very busy by treatment.

P.S. Stubby existed