Making DP-28s as useful as PPShs

[Max 'DonXavi' von B.]

You can also create the killer combo of one squad with DP-28 for the surpression task and two with PPSH to engage the pinned enemy in close range.

[IJoe]

^^ But if you don't bother, they do even better with PPSh.

[RedGuard]

sad but true

[cephalos]

PPshs are lame. DP-28 FTW!

[Hendrik 'DarcReaver' S.]

I've used them sometime against PE halftracks. I think it could be an idea to slightly increase their supression and add a 3rd DP28 to the squad.

Currently the PPsh adds like 6 smgs to the strelky squads, which perform better on the move and are overall way more efficient.

[RedGuard]

not to mention vet1 strelky have airborne armor which synergises with ppsh because they gain armor bonus while on the move, and we all know ppsh are effective on the move. So why would you want your strelky standing still with a dp28 when i could be doing more damage on the move with ppsh and taking less damage as well because of airborne armor.

makes no sense i hope dp28 is buffed or another gun is added to the squad. either that or lower muni

[Sturmovik]

PD-28 will be usefull wile the attack.
Stationary MG was effective for the defence lines, & resistance points.
PD-28 will be usefull in the infantry like attacks.
That will be intensive hard battles, like the historical battles was ...

P.S.: Stalingrad city infantry crossing Volga river for landing (incompetently showing by western historicans in the COD episode) was mainly armed with PPSh, few with PD-28 & Mosin rifles (for the MR support). Most of them have a small Shovel Spades as a close combat weapon. All of them have a granades.
Main  task of the Nazi was cut off units of the 62 army & surround them all. Hard battle ended with a victory by the soviet troops.

[neosdark]

P.S.: Stalingrad city infantry crossing Volga river for landing (incompetently showing by western historicans in the COD episode) was mainly armed with PPSh, few with PD-28 & Mosin rifles (for the MR support). Most of them have a small Shovel Spades as a close combat weapon. All of them have a granades.
Main  task of the Nazi was cut off units of the 62 army & surround them all. Hard battle ended with a victory by the soviet troops.

What does this have to do with the topic at hand Mr. Professional Historian?? The PD-28 as you refer to it is just the Russian transliteration of DP-28 (Тоже самое слово, в прoстых словах) Anyway we know how it is used, as the Strelky use it as you described.

The argument stands at how to change the efficiency of the DP-28 to match the PPSh-41 in efficiency as an upgrade for the Strelky and make it worth getting. Don't make useless comments.

Anyway my idea is to decrease the cost of the upgrade and provide a different ability to the current one (forget what its called since I don't get this upgrade at all).

It works as follows: When a Strelky unit is in cover of any sort or in a building, this upgrade can be activated providing unlimited amount of suppressing fire (giving suppression to the enemy units caught in it by x1.2 (or so, it was an arbitrary number so no screaming please) but forcing the Strelky to stay in place until the ability runs out of time.

Basically it would work like a short period HMG (only in cover at that) but you would have a unit that is unable to move, and thus cannot provide mobile suppression fire, and set the cool-down to about 2.5 minutes so you can't automatically move to the next choke-point and provide suppression.

This would work well with the Propaganda strategy doctrine (but disable the ability in trenches so as not to make it overpowered), and I'm sure it would find its way to work with the other doctrines as well.

[RedGuard]

Your idea is a rather complicated fix to a minor problem that requires a simple buff. Im supporting darc's idea of adding a 3rd dp-28 to the squad

and did the history lesson really bother you that much?

[Sturmovik]

Well ... misunderstanding.
I agree with one thing adding another one PD-28. It's a helpful thing.

[IJoe]

Well ... misunderstanding.
I agree with one thing adding another one PD-28. It's a helpful thing.

I don't, I want some suppressing unit for soviets, no matter will it be a unit, or an ability.

[RedGuard]

give supression to a Mg team or something, or some new reward unit to come

the dp-28 however needs something more if it is ever to be of any use, and not trumped by ppsh

[neosdark]

Your idea is a rather complicated fix to a minor problem that requires a simple buff. Im supporting darc's idea of adding a 3rd dp-28 to the squad

and did the history lesson really bother you that much?

It certainly did bother me because it seemed like a nonsensical post. Anyway no matter, I apologize for overreacting I was a bit tipsy.

Anyway the problem with adding a 3rd DP is now you have 3 slower soldiers with a very limited ability to provide suppression. A buff to make it on par with the PPSh would have very limiting effect.

What I mean is that while, great you have 3 guys with DP-28s that are fine for long and mid range work, most of the later battles of the game seem to take place in close range, more movement as people start relying more on battlefield-like tactics instead of taking cover and sitting there like ducks. The PPSh forces the enemy to take the cover and fire approach, while the DP-28 lets them (enemies) move forward and when they get a bit closer it becomes painfully hard to keep the Strelky alive, because the advantage is gone. But the PPSh is perfect for attacking the guys in cover basically making it much better than the DP-28 whether there was 2, 3, or even 5.

The PPSh forces them into cover and moves up, giving no breathing room. The DP-28 (unless given a suppression buff like crazy) just lets them come closer and closer, barely suppressing them when they come within grenade range and you just lost your advantage. BOOM. A third one will not in anyway make a difference, fine perhaps a squad will be forced into suppression a second earlier but they will keep crawling until they are within grenades throw. Still a seeming wasted upgrade.

The ability I proposed creates instant suppression and forces the enemy to rethink their plan, not give them breathing room, but make them improvise, while letting your troops gain the upper hand. Of course this doesn't quite take all other things into account, in fact it leaves the Strelky open to artillery and mortars, but the main purpose of any MG is to provide suppression in some way or another and my way seems fair.

[cephalos]

but any type of MG is supposed to be defensive weapon, don't you think? Two DP squad will be as mobile as three DP squad - they just sit in cover and shoot. MGs are defensive weapons, they aren't meant to be this mobile.

[neosdark]

Well sure it can be as defensive as it wants but without the right stats or a new ability the DP-28 is pretty much useless. Ask any Soviet player whether they use the PPSh or the DP and you will get PPSh as the answer 98% of the time, there is a reason for that.