Soviet Tanks-Axi tanks

[Hamasei]

I have some questions, balance issues, posible solutions about tanks in EF:

I undestand why panther dont kill infantry in vcoh, its balance, you have the rest of the army to kill infantry.

Jagdpanther its the same, dont kill everithing because is a tank hunter.

I understand why Tiger And KT kill everithing, tiger is too expensive 800MP , and you only can call a KT ones by 500MP, 2 tanks need 9 CP points, are docTanks, their role is a doc role like Howitzer, Pershing, Hummel ETC all Doc "super werapons" but I dont undestand why Is-2 kill everything with no doc and no CP and a bit expensive than the panther why? in my oponion Is 2 could be a AT tank for balance the game, in Aniquilate with no pop cap no way to kill 5 Is2, they are like a tiger 1, destroy everithing.

Posbile solutions:

- Limit the IS2 possible ingame at the same time to 2.

(the best ideia in my opinion)
                   
OR

- Unlimit the tiger1 ingame possible units to be able to use blitzdoc in aniquilate no pop cap, or put the limit to 2. (other good idea in my opinion)

( i have readed a argument to disscus this idea in other topic like this: IS2 tank in ww2 was 2313123 tiger only 500 or something like that but in ww2 only was 87-105 wirbelwind and 45!! ostwin please how many tigers was in fiel in ww2 is not an argument for COH balance.)

OR

- Change the accuracy of the panther to be able to kill infantry. LOL

 (i dont like this idea but i dont like IS2 all role is unfair balancing)

OR

- Change the accuracy of the IS2 to only be able to kill tanks like panther.

(will be more fair and fun, soviet player have easy long game win presently)

In a 4v4 nopop mach if 3 soviet players take heavy assault doc they can build 3 Isu152 at the same time and 6-7-8-9-10 O.O IS2 is totaly unstoppable with katiuxka spam to destroy all AT infantry and all At guns-weak axi tank hunters, axi players only can do 4 super heavy tanks ones or 4 tiger1 at the same time..

Please searh a solution for this it will make the long nopop games more fun and gg.

Another question where is the KV1? i did not play past V.EF and KV1 is interesting tank.

Plese if you dont like this post disscus it with balance arguments thx.

[IJoe]

I'm doubtful that unit changes should ever be done with any regard to any none-traditional multiplayer game mode (i.e. no pop cap).
Basically, if you choose no pop cap, you agree, that it (the game) is already crippled. Otherwise, it appears, as if you turned on some cheat mode, and then started complaining about balance.

[pariah]

Indeed no pop-cap essentially breaks the game. It shouldn't be used for balancing.

Also, Panthers are actually pretty good versus infantry...

[Paciat]

IS-2 has lower speed, turret speed, accuracy, accuracy on the move gun range and reload speed than a Panther.
Panthers are much better at circlestrafing, chasing damaged tanks and you can get them to vet 3 without fighting or call-in 2 of them for only 1000MP. PE also has the AT halftrack that can brake treads leaving IS-2 outranged.

[Hamasei]

Indeed no pop-cap essentially breaks the game. It shouldn't be used for balancing.

Also, Panthers are actually pretty good versus infantry...

mmmmm sure? LOL

[Chancellor]

IS-2 has lower speed, turret speed, accuracy, accuracy on the move gun range and reload speed than a Panther.
Panthers are much better at circlestrafing, chasing damaged tanks and you can get them to vet 3 without fighting or call-in 2 of them for only 1000MP. PE also has the AT halftrack that can brake treads leaving IS-2 outranged.

Na we tested the IS-2 in beta.  It actually has the exact same reload speed as the panther, and in a head-on slug fest, can beat the panther shot for shot and live with half its health remaining.

All the other things you said are true though.  The Panther seems more agile.

[pariah]

Indeed no pop-cap essentially breaks the game. It shouldn't be used for balancing.

Also, Panthers are actually pretty good versus infantry...

mmmmm sure? LOL

What part of my post were you referring to? Either way, i'm pretty sure about both...

[Hamasei]

IS-2 has lower speed, turret speed, accuracy, accuracy on the move gun range and reload speed than a Panther.
Panthers are much better at circlestrafing, chasing damaged tanks and you can get them to vet 3 without fighting or call-in 2 of them for only 1000MP. PE also has the AT halftrack that can brake treads leaving IS-2 outranged.

your arguments are good yes, but think about the pop game and the no pop game, if you put pop game you cant do alot of IS2, 2 limit is ok for have other things in your army or not? it will be good for make no pop game more fun..
Post Merge: [time]lun 28 mar 2011 14:20:19 GMT+8[/time]

Indeed no pop-cap essentially breaks the game. It shouldn't be used for balancing.

Also, Panthers are actually pretty good versus infantry...

mmmmm sure? LOL

What part of my post were you referring to? Either way, i'm pretty sure about both...

Panthers arent good vs infantry men learn about the game first and then speak please.. 

no pop cap limit break the game if in the game are units like IS2 with overpower. with other units dont break the game.

[IJoe]

OP panther blob definitely breaks the no pop game in my opinion. It's just so frustrating to see them being frequently called in in pairs and practically for free. So lets limit them as well, to, say, no more than 1 panther battle group in, like, 10 minutes (time needs to be adjusted a bit), and no more than 5 panthers on the field at any given time. 

[Hamasei]

OP panther blob definitely breaks the no pop game in my opinion. It's just so frustrating to see them being frequently called in in pair and practically for free. So lets limit the as well, to, say, no more than 1 panther battle group in, like, 10 minutes (time needs to be adjusted a bit). 

Lets talk about balance please, panther cant beat good the AT guns and de AT infantry IS2 yes, then, panther blob is stoppable by AT guns men! try to use the weak of the units to kill it, IS2 dont have a weak point in spam.

[IJoe]

I am talking about balance:
panther battle group is practically free, it is especially well illustrated, when one loses most of the map, has nothing but his bare ass, and then, all of a sudden, he pops up two second best (first best among mass productive) tanks! WTF??
Besides, AT guns take forever to kill a panther and are easily wiped out by infantry, so you shouldn't refer to these here. It's like saying: "Hey! Germans have 88 to kill IS2!"

[pariah]

Unless Panthers were nerfed in a patch or something, they are very accurate versus infantry, and blow them up real good. How is that not good versus infantry?

[Hamasei]

Unless Panthers were nerfed in a patch or something, they are very accurate versus infantry, and blow them up real good. How is that not good versus infantry?

Ok in Vcohtov Panthers arent good vs infantry and never will be good vs infantry because balance. I will try it in VEF
Post Merge: [time]lun 28 mar 2011 14:52:01 GMT+8[/time]

I am talking about balance:
panther battle group is practically free, it is especially well illustrated, when one loses most of the map, has nothing but his bare ass, and then, all of a sudden, he pops up two second best (first best among mass productive) tanks! WTF??
Besides, AT guns take forever to kill a panther and are easily wiped out by infantry, so you shouldn't refer to these here. It's like saying: "Hey! Germans have 88 to kill IS2!"

1000 MP is free for you? LOL, no, germans have pack 38 to kill al tanks and pack 88 to make a "No enemy tank Area" LOLLOLLOL
mmmm dont lose the map ! and combine units, guards, AT guns, Tanks, Arty you want to play alwais with 2-3 same spam units ? ahha OK but i want more fun game.

[IJoe]

Don't be too picky: 1000 mp is free, compared to the real cost.
And in the absence of 24 pop I find this frustrating (or simply unfair, if you will), if not overwhelming. 
Yeah, about paks: right now, these are only symbolically more expensive, a lot better, stealthy, and vet without fighting.

[pariah]

What is this "real cost" you speak of?  I find that Manpower is the post restrictive resource, particularly late-game.