Does anyone think that the Soviet is a bit too weak?

[GodlikeDennis]

Soviet abilities are free remember. A Soviet player will have more munitions midgame than an American player since he will have to pay for everything. Think about it, a Soviet player only has to pay 50 munitions to upgrade his conscripts with all rifles and free molotovs. That's equivalent to just 2 US nades. Troops don't have the upkeep either so it doesn't effect midgame. It's more of a lategame nerf to stop massive tank attacks while doing limitless IL-2 runs etc. Soviets have to make a choice on what to spend their munitions on just like the rest of the factions. They just do it differently.

Trust me when I say Soviets should have no trouble midgame. Katyushas, snipers and strelky are all extremely good in this period.

[Flanker1949]

I do trust you. You guys have much more experience than me. But just since German normal AI always come out with a massive strike very fast. They use infantry supported by machine gunner, sniper, IFV, and stunk. It is hard  to build enough AT united by that time. And if we start to focus on buliding AT unit, we wouldn't be able to go capture lands. And if we don't go capture the lands, we would have hard time upgrade our units and buildings. Specially on a map like Kursk where there are no points for you to hold and you just can not consentrate too many of your troops at one point. If it's a map like Leningrad we wouldn't have to worry about it. We just go blow up a few bridge and hold on the last pass and wait unit we have enough upgrade and troops to overrun the enemy. Since the Soviet can not even blow up a bridge, we have to go and babwire and tank trap the bridge.

[Zerstörer]

Soviets used to float muni more than Brits mid late game. This gave way to spamming a gazillion mines(for those who know how good they are and don't forget to use them) as well as ll the arty abilities which were always available when the player needed them without any worry.

[Chancellor]

I do trust you. You guys have much more experience than me. But just since German normal AI always come out with a massive strike very fast. They use infantry supported by machine gunner, sniper, IFV, and stunk. It is hard  to build enough AT united by that time. And if we start to focus on buliding AT unit, we wouldn't be able to go capture lands. And if we don't go capture the lands, we would have hard time upgrade our units and buildings. Specially on a map like Kursk where there are no points for you to hold and you just can not consentrate too many of your troops at one point. If it's a map like Leningrad we wouldn't have to worry about it. We just go blow up a few bridge and hold on the last pass and wait unit we have enough upgrade and troops to overrun the enemy. Since the Soviet can not even blow up a bridge, we have to go and babwire and tank trap the bridge.

Try changing the game types you play.  It might change your perspective on balance.  Compstompers who play on Leningrad and other noob maps will never be taken seriously on balance.

[Seeme]

It a matter of who can blow the bridge before the enemy comes kinda thing.

[Loupblanc]

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=nerfed


1.    nerfed   420 up, 25 down
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The term "nerfing" comes from the online gaming world of Ultima Online.

At one point in the game, the developers reduced the power of swords in melee combat.

This resulted in players complaining that it was like they were hitting each other with nerf bats, not swords.

From then on, if ever something gets made less worth while than it had been originally, it is considered 'nerfed'
"Oh man, they reduced the dmg on the berserker class and now it's totally nerfed!"

"Damn, the Devs nerfed those axe's real good!"
by Dave Elliott Jan 11, 2005 share this
2.    nerfed   88 up, 40 down
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v: something that worked at one time, but was changed (usually for the worse) by someone who did not understand that particular thing's usefulness. You used to have something cool, but now your stuff
suxors. Often refers to MMOFPS's or MMORPG's, when the game designers change in-game rules and they screw stuff up.
"That game used to pwn, but now it blows. They took out the best part."
"Whatever I was doing, I'm not doing it anymore, I got nerfed."
"Our junk was so much better before the designers all nerfed it."
by CmdrAwesome Dec 29, 2004 share this
3.    Nerfed   33 up, 24 down
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1.To make something pointless whereas before it was productive
2.To Stop something working

Usually a term used in online games
'' Aww Gawd They Nerfed My Fave Farming spot''
nerf nef ner nerfed crap shit
by James94 Feb 24, 2008 share this

4.    NERFED   8 up, 104 down
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I've always wondered what exactly it means - in context it's code that's been deliberatly broken or functionality removed from a program in order to sell a higher priced alternative or also used as a general description of code that no longer works (after patching or updating)
I think it's something like "Not Even Really Functioning Effectivly Disabled/Destroyed" or something similar

[Flanker1949]

But there are a lot of the unit which does not have ablity and yet we have to suppend ammunitions to upkeep them.

And the Soviet is the only one without suppressing capability. Unlike other factions, they have machine gun. I tried to use the DP-27 to suppress the enemy, but it never worked. And the Soviet machine gun nest is still using the obsolated Maxim M1910? I thought they have much better stuff like the Vladimirov KPV-14.5mm.

Especialy when you versus the pazer elite. They have powerful infantry since the beginning of the game plus they have a lot very good anti-infantry vehical was well. Soviet will take a good beating. Especially since half of the conscripts are unarmed. Can we at least give them a Nagant revolver?

[GodlikeDennis]

Blob control is the role of the sniper with his callin arty. That's part of the reason he's so dominant and important to tech to at the moment.

[Red_Stinger]

Also I somewhat disagree with the muni upkeep of soviet (which break the fun of playing 'em), I think however that soviet should be nerfed in mid-late game due to their very powerful combo.

But there are a lot of the unit which does not have ablity and yet we have to suppend ammunitions to upkeep them.

And the Soviet is the only one without suppressing capability. Unlike other factions, they have machine gun. I tried to use the DP-27 to suppress the enemy, but it never worked. And the Soviet machine gun nest is still using the obsolated Maxim M1910? I thought they have much better stuff like the Vladimirov KPV-14.5mm.

Especialy when you versus the pazer elite. They have powerful infantry since the beginning of the game plus they have a lot very good anti-infantry vehical was well. Soviet will take a good beating. Especially since half of the conscripts are unarmed. Can we at least give them a Nagant revolver?

Hm. Soviet in EF are based on "ennemy at the gates" movie, so conscript will remained as they are

Seriously: conscript are very cheap, and so is their upgrade which enable them molotovs and full rifles. Even after their upgrade, they are still very cheap for what they do.
Against PE you should really try to obtain PTRD infantry ASAP, as they perform quite well against PE.

[Flanker1949]

Re: Dennis
But we hardly ever get a chance to upgrade the sniper with that ability since I have to keep a large number of troopes to keep the pressure on the enemy. Because the upkeep I needed for my troop, my ammo regeneration rate is often 0. My last game for example, I had 5 T-34s and 3 IS-2s, 2 Katiushas, 1 conscript team and 2 engineer teams. By the time the game ended, I manage to capture all of the ammo depots and build outpost on all them. But my ammo regeneration rate was still 0.

Re: Red Stinger
Yes, you are right. But in the "Enemy at the gate" movie, the conscripts are allowed to pick up whatever weapon they find. It can be pistol, rifle, SMG, MG, rocket launchers and so on. But in the game they are not allowed pick up pistols and rifles, and the enemy hardly ever drop their MGs and RLs.

Since you mentioned the tank hunter and its PTRD, I just could not understand that the tank hunter need to cost 8 manpower? Think about this way, the tank hunter is a 4 man group and they have only limited anti-tank capability. An AT-gun cost only 3 manpower and it is far more capable that the tank hunters. Of course that you may argu that the AT-gun has very limited anti-personal capability. But if I put a conscript with an AT-gun together that well make them far more capable that the tank hunter, and a conscript term and an AT-gun only cost you 7 manpower. So no one would ever bother to train the tank hunter. So we just want to suggest that the tank hunter only cost 4 manpowers.

By the way, I have got another WW2 weapon encyclopedia. Just post here to share with everybody.

From the encyclopedia, it shows that Soviet used a AT-gun which is 45mm, how come the our in game AT-gun is still using the 37mm one?
As I recall, in game we upgrade the AT-gun, may I suggest to make the upgraded version of the AT-gun 45mm. 
Thanks for the attention.
Post Merge: February 25, 2011, 01:33:48 PMAh....
The encyclopedia file is too big, 70MB.
OK if anyone want it, please leave you name and e-mail address below and I'll send it too you.
Or if anyone know that I can upload it somewhere else pubic for everyone to download.

[GodlikeDennis]

My common build order (standard resources) with Soviets is:

Ingenery (Build barracks/cap) - Command Squad - Conscript X3 - Support Barracks (Long range upgrade) - Sniper team (arty upgrade)

This is usually timed so that by the time the sharpshooters are out I have the 125 munitions to upgrade it. This occurs 2-3 minutes into the game and he usually lives the whole game. Yet again it comes down to the gametype you're playing. Don't play against coms where your entire force is tanks. Even with 0 munitions, Soviets can use most of their abilities. This is the price you pay for tank spamming.

Really, this should not be in the balance forum since you honestly don't have the qualifications to make balance assessments. Balance cannot be gauged from games against coms.

[Blackbishop]

Don't worry fellas! Conscripts should be fixed on the next patch, so armed soldiers can pass their rifle to the next soldier when die and unarmed conscripts won't rush the enemy (or at least that's what we have planned).

[Flanker1949]

Wow, that's great news.

[cephalos]

finally

[CrazyScott17]

the balance issues and infantry rushes (if they were in skirmish) were probaly due to the improved AI and also i agree that the ammount of upgrades you need to get for some units are insane and that you have to upgrade to produce the tank and support however i do know there are powerful but maybe shorter upgrade times and lower upgrade cost would balance this out

can i have the encyclopedia and also is the name necsasarry anyway
Don't post email adds plz name Joshua