Slight buffs for the late game Brits.

[Paciat]

First of all I dont care about LTs arti and stacking bonuses. For ballance they can be nerfed. This is not a topic on that.

I would like to see some minor changes in the British late game.

1. Buff the healing power of a Captain. Vet 2 Captain shoul heal at least as fast as vet 1 Wehrmacht infantry but only in 1 friendly territory.

2. Change the Commando tree so that Commando HQ is at 4CPs while Tetrarch stays at 5CP.

3. Tetrarch glider should be able to produce Commando jeeps with same build cost as US jeep and same smoke ability as Tetrarchs/upgraded Shermans.

4. Change Churchill Croc armor and gun.
Late war Crocs were Churchills Mk VII with OQF 75mm gun and better armor than a Tiger I. A Cromwells gun and Pershings/vet 0 Tigers armor wont change much in the gameplay becouse a single Panther will still kill it with ease. An overrepaired Crock will still have less HP, worst armor, gun and speed than a Vet 3 Tiger but this change will make you want to save CPs (it can cost more CPs than it does now) for this blob killer.

[GodlikeDennis]

I support all of these changes plus more.

Commandos need to benefit from vet. The problem lies in the way they often work independently from LTs. Nanaki fixed this by creating a global vet system unique to commandos. I'm not certain exactly what he did but it worked when I tried his mod.

Royal engineers need a way to spend munitions, through some arty strike or something.

Brit 25lbers need a slight damage/range buff. They are pretty much the worst arty in the game.

However, supercharged mortar range needs slightly reducing and vet stacking needs to go. I would be quite happy with Brits if all these things changed although many other design issues remain (soldier armour/mobile HQs *cough*).

[Blackbishop]

Royal Commandos Tree must get a reorder. The Glider-HQ come when no one need it.

The Staghound should be "fixed" to be on 'terms' with the Stuart the most logic unit to replace.

And as Kolaris said those topics should be checked.

Brits certainly had a high amount of bullshit they could throw out in 2.6, but I think it should be pretty obvious that once you move into the mid-game they're severely lacking. Especially with these (appropriate) nerfs.

Oh, oh wait, I mean without Roo/Staghound ridiculousness. Of course.

They have very few options for dealing with Elite Armour and moving Vehicles. Their scaling is very bad. Their tanks are gimicky if they don't win with shock value.

A couple of things I consider good changes:

- Make the Recon Section into a desirable upgrade. You don't want it overpowering in the first few minutes of course, since you get it for free. The Marksman in the squad uses a unique weapon - give it hefty damage/accuracy bonuses against Elite Armour, similar to a Sniper's bonuses against Elite Armour.

- Veterancy and scaling. You're far better off with 3 unvetted Lieutenants than 1 or even 2 vetted ones. Decrease the stackable, unvetted bonuses but increase the modifiers achieved with Vet 2/3 above and beyond what was taken away.

- Rifle Grenades vs Elite Armour. All Grenades do 1.0x damage to all infantry except Rifle Grenades, which do 25% less damage to Elite Armour. Increase to the standard 1.0x.

Just addressing Infantry combat in the late game, I think these three things would help even out the Commonwealth against Elite Armour Grens without having to resort to un-fun, roundabout bull like Commando Democharges and FOO.

Rifle Grenades and Recon Elements would be the go-to choices for fighting Elite Armour Infantry, while the Bren Gun remains useful for its role in British AV.

As @ChocoboKnight88 said, the demo sapper bug needs to be checked.

[GodlikeDennis]

This is true, Brits aren't great vs elite armour. Because most players grenspam vs the Brits, almost everyone goes arty doctrine to counter it. Recon sections definately do need a buff but I personally thing riflenade sections are still quite effective. I think the Recon snipe should be free but only unlocked after the field support is out to not affect early game (and with a moderately lengthy cooldown).

[AbhMkh]

First of all I dont care about LTs arti and stacking bonuses. For ballance they can be nerfed. This is not a topic on that.

I would like to see some minor changes in the British late game.

1. Buff the healing power of a Captain. Vet 2 Captain shoul heal at least as fast as vet 1 Wehrmacht infantry but only in 1 friendly territory.

2. Change the Commando tree so that Commando HQ is at 4CPs while Tetrarch stays at 5CP.

3. Tetrarch glider should be able to produce Commando jeeps with same build cost as US jeep and same smoke ability as Tetrarchs/upgraded Shermans.

4. Change Churchill Croc armor and gun.
Late war Crocs were Churchills Mk VII with OQF 75mm gun and better armor than a Tiger I. A Cromwells gun and Pershings/vet 0 Tigers armor wont change much in the gameplay becouse a single Panther will still kill it with ease. An overrepaired Crock will still have less HP, worst armor, gun and speed than a Vet 3 Tiger but this change will make you want to save CPs (it can cost more CPs than it does now) for this blob killer.

+1

[Strayker]

Though few things really makes sense...mostly the Commandos veterancy, i actually wont support this idea, cause i dont want any further changing in vanila factions. But thats my point of view...well see how the Devs will react to this.

[AdmV0rl0n]

First of all I dont care about LTs arti and stacking bonuses. For ballance they can be nerfed. This is not a topic on that.

I would like to see some minor changes in the British late game.

1. Buff the healing power of a Captain. Vet 2 Captain shoul heal at least as fast as vet 1 Wehrmacht infantry but only in 1 friendly territory.

2. Change the Commando tree so that Commando HQ is at 4CPs while Tetrarch stays at 5CP.

3. Tetrarch glider should be able to produce Commando jeeps with same build cost as US jeep and same smoke ability as Tetrarchs/upgraded Shermans.

4. Change Churchill Croc armor and gun.
Late war Crocs were Churchills Mk VII with OQF 75mm gun and better armor than a Tiger I. A Cromwells gun and Pershings/vet 0 Tigers armor wont change much in the gameplay becouse a single Panther will still kill it with ease. An overrepaired Crock will still have less HP, worst armor, gun and speed than a Vet 3 Tiger but this change will make you want to save CPs (it can cost more CPs than it does now) for this blob killer.

The enginnering faction.
The above tank could arrive on field, and have the above upgrades. This could be purchased by AMMO, atypically an area the engineers suffer from having no or little outlet.

Engineer sappers / sniper squads should have greades at 30 ammo or similar.

Engineer sappers should be able to build road blocks at a cost of ammo.

Arty units should be able to super charge rounds for a short time at a relatively expensive rate of ammo.

In a nutshell, some additional ways should be brought in game, even if its for example just the tank trap/road blocks that cost ammo - so the faction has an additional meritable way of spending the ammo.

[Paciat]

Engineer sappers should be able to build road blocks at a cost of ammo.

Who would build roadblocks if you can build cheaper mines?

Gun upgrades could be done to Churchills.
6lbs->OQF 75mm for 75 or even 100 ammo. No animation or model changes. Just a change of stats.

[AbhMkh]

well on a second thought , roadblocks by sappers seems to be a good suggestion

[GodlikeDennis]

Roadblocks on sappers is a terrible suggestion. Why should engineers get a doctinal ability from scorched earth for free? Why should engineers get a doctrinal ability from arty? It sound like you just want engineers to get everything.

The above buffs to churchills plus a unique way to spend munis are enough to make the engineers doctrine useful.

[AbhMkh]

lol , because they are cheap hence they get everything for free

[GodlikeDennis]

Yes, what a valuable insight you have provided to the forum AbhMkh...

[ReckLESS]

Dennis, I think that you've misread V0rl0n:

Engineer sappers should be able to build road blocks at a cost of ammo.

Only from Royal Engineers Doctrine - thus roadblocks will be doctrinal just as PE's

[GodlikeDennis]

No, you misread me. The royal engineers sappers will have an ability that is stolen from another doctrine and doesn't cost them a point to use. There is also the matter that allies can clear roadblocks far easier than axis due to them being taken into account during the design process.

[Wilson]

If the 25 pounder needs a buff, I'd prefer it to be in range/cooldown/cost, something other than damage. I think the German nebelwerfer is good because it's effective artillery and worth having, but it doesn't blow entire squads up with lucky hits.

I like the OP's suggested changes. Expensive upgrades to Churchills would be a nice way to spend munis for the engineers in my opinion. It could also serve to make the Churchills more useful in late game, at high munitions cost.