Unit suggestion thread:

[Versedhorison]

Panzerwerfer
Type: Support Arty. ( 50FUEL, 300MP)
Role: Anti-Building, Anti-Tank.

the Panzerwerfer would act as the German Kats, firing 8 15cm HE Rockets in quick speed, it would be armed with a MG34 MG For self-defence, and could hold a small squad of 3 Troops inside it.

Upgrades: Flammenbolshevik - Gains the ablitty to fire all 8 of now-incendiary tipped rockets
PanzerkampfwagenMachinen - Replaces the MG34 with a light 20mm Cannon.

Sure a cheaper, more mobile, nebel with more firepower and lots of different abilities.
Can it make a sandwich and buy beer too? 

minus the *make believe troop carrying cababilities* and the silly upgrades and I could see that vehcile working in the game.

[cephalos]

I like it, try to edit it for stats for unit.

Unfortunatelly, I don't understand you quite well... 

[Paciat]

Panzerwerfer
Type: Support Arty. ( 50FUEL, 300MP)
Role: Anti-Building, Anti-Tank.

the Panzerwerfer would act as the German Kats, firing 8 15cm HE Rockets in quick speed, it would be armed with a MG34 MG For self-defence, and could hold a small squad of 3 Troops inside it.

Upgrades: Flammenbolshevik - Gains the ablitty to fire all 8 of now-incendiary tipped rockets
PanzerkampfwagenMachinen - Replaces the MG34 with a light 20mm Cannon.

Sure a cheaper, more mobile, nebel with more firepower and lots of different abilities.
Can it make a sandwich and buy beer too? 

minus the *make believe troop carrying cababilities* and the silly upgrades and I could see that vehcile working in the game.

Youre right but the price of that kind of arti should be much higher.
A nebel fireing 6 rockets costs 325MP.
A mobile nebel fireing 8 rockets should cost 420-450MP and 60-80Fuel.

[Akalonor]

Typo, sorry, was recommending you add statistics to the units ,like health and such.

[comrade2012]

Ostheer definately needs Panzer II and Panzer III. Panzer II could be Ostheers "Puma" and Panzer III could be equal to that of the stuart.

[Akalonor]

not stuart, Id say make it better than the stuart since the stuart is the equal of the Puma and the Pz III could easily take on a stuart.And if you look a tthe satistics Stuarts were outgunned in everything but speed.

[LeaderH]

However, the Panzer III is of incredibly thin armour when hitted by

1. PIAT
2. Bazooka
3. 57mm AT
4. any 75mm gun
5. PTRD

And rifle grenades should damage the tank if it was a side-hit also, the british have HEAT rifle grenades, as I recall. I think about 8 nades to destroy/immobilize one is fair, and maybe only 2-3 to damage the engine. PIAT should be lethal (like 3 to 4-shot kill) to a skirtless Panzer III.

It will surely beat a Stuart so I would suggest the PIII to cost slightly more than the stuart. However, I shall note that the Stuart have quite good frontal armour to the PIII gun. It should take at least 4 shots (in game) to kill a Stuart frontally with a PIII. And should the accuracy of the PIII gun be poor when on the move?

(btw why noone ever suggested German Riflegrenades?)

It would be fair to have skirts fitted on the PIII in late game so it would not be completely useless due to it's vulnerability.

Actually, I would like to make a suggestion of a weapon, the K98ZF41, which is an "infantry" rifle with a low-power scope, which would be quite interesting as an upgrade to your best troops.

Also, the StG44 scoped version ... that thing is interesting also, not very useful as a sniper but surely a deadly weapon.

[comrade2012]

Yes, the Panzer III should definately be better than the Stuart. Also, It should not be damaged by rifle grenades. grenades dont have armor penatrating power, grenades are only good versus infantry.

The Panzer III also needs the ability to be ugraded to a longer barrel(not a bigger gun, just a longer one) The longer barrel may give it a little more penetrating power, and range.

It will also need an upgrade for side armor. The side armor will give it better protection from Basookas, AT's, and Piats, but wont protect it much more from a regular tank gun.

[Akalonor]

The Pz III was upgraded with 3 different guns, medium one has enough to take on the Stuart(50mm I think), small one is only 37 mm sooo.. yeah not going to work well, large one is 75mm, which one do you see fit?I think 37mm upgrade to 50mm would be best.

[comrade2012]

yea, the 75mm was only short barreled too. I dont think it ever equipped a 50mm, but it might have. All i thought it ever had was a 37mm, one with a longer barrel, and one with a short barreled 75mm.

[Paciat]

Yes, the Panzer III should definately be better than the Stuart.

The Panzer III also needs the ability to be ugraded to a longer barrel(not a bigger gun, just a longer one) The longer barrel may give it a little more penetrating power, and range.

It will also need an upgrade for side armor. The side armor will give it better protection from Basookas, AT's, and Piats, but wont protect it much more from a regular tank gun.

If it will be better than Stuart it will come later in the game.
Thats why it dosnt need a gun upgrade, it needs a good gun (best that PZIII had) from the start (5cm L60). A Puma gun with AP rounds ability.

PzIII armor was similar to PzIV (both upgraded several times) so I see PzIII with PzIV armor (and armor skirts upgrade) but with 100HP less (500HP).

PzIII should not be compared to a Stuart but to a less armored, faster Churchill!
It will be a Stuart (and all light armor) killer.

[Akalonor]

I agree Paciat, but your metaphor of it being a faster lighter churchill should be faster light cormwell 

[Paciat]

I agree Paciat, but your metaphor of it being a faster lighter churchill should be faster light cormwell 

I want the same gun as Churchill (same dmg as Cromwell but lower armor penetration and aera of effect) thats why I compared PzIII to a Churchill.
Upgunned Puma has a gun like this too but PzIII needs AP rounds ability to be usefull when medium tanks apear.

[Venoxxis]

(btw why noone ever suggested German Riflegrenades?)

Instead of suggestion a finishsed unit, i will suggest a weapon. This weapon was widly used as trustly AT weapon, especially when it came up and the armour of the tanks wasnt so thick yet.

In this thread we could form with your ideas a usefull slot for this weapon in the ostheer which it surly deserves.


So what im talking about now?
In general the weapon was called "Gewehrgranatgerät". It can be translated as rifle-granade-lancher. This name was given to several weapons, weapons which had the ability to shoot granades. As a example the widly used K98, the "Granate" was set on the top of the barrel, and the fired round hit it and accelerated it.

HE grandes could be used and AT granades as well. The technology of later AT granades are compareable to the ones of the schreck which made it pretty powerfull. (hollow charge tech.)


I would suggest using the
"K98 Gewehrgranatgerät"
Gewehrgranatgerät K98 Info.

To make the K98 able to shot granades,
a "Schießbecher" gotta be installed first to mount the granades.

Schießbecher big/smal :



Mounted and ready to fire:



Its Penatration abilities are quite differrent.. early heavy AT granades could penetrate 80mm @60°. Thats quite good but late-war granades developed by the "SS" could penetrate up to 120mm of steel (SS-Gewehrpanzergranate 61).
Granten-info (german) couldnt find a usefull english link.





To put it in a nutshell:

- The granades were widly used
- Useable on the K98
- great anti tank power up to 100m
- variation of anti tank weapons ingame
- a new AT-weapon for the front of steel is a must have



Regards,
-V-

Also i agree to paciat, since the Pz3 shouldnt be a puma/stuart compareable vehicle. Late versions actually were compareable to the Pz4.

Ostheers stuart kind should stay the awesome pz II :p

[Paciat]

Instead of suggestion a finishsed unit, i will suggest a weapon. This weapon was widly used as trustly AT weapon, especially when it came up and the armour of the tanks wasnt so thick yet.

In this thread we could form with your ideas a usefull slot for this weapon in the ostheer which it surly deserves.


So what im talking about now?
In general the weapon was called "Gewehrgranatgerät". It can be translated as rifle-granade-lancher. This name was given to several weapons, weapons which had the ability to shoot granades. As a example the widly used K98, the "Granate" was set on the top of the barrel, and the fired round hit it and accelerated it.

HE grandes could be used and AT granades as well. The technology of later AT granades are compareable to the ones of the schreck which made it pretty powerfull. (hollow charge tech.)


I would suggest using the
"K98 Gewehrgranatgerät"
Gewehrgranatgerät K98 Info.

To make the K98 able to shot granades,
a "Schießbecher" gotta be installed first to mount the granades.

Schießbecher big/smal :



To put it in a nutshell:

- The granades were widly used
- Useable on the K98
- great anti tank power up to 100m
- variation of anti tank weapons ingame
- a new AT-weapon for the front of steel is a must have


Regards,
-V-

Thats probably becouse wehrmacht has a Assault Grenadiers ability in Biltz doctrine.

Also there would have to be 2 kinds of upgrades becouse there were 2 kinds of granades (AT and anti infantry).

Also, how would the squad be called? "Granade Grenadiers?"