General Ideas

[analord]

So I was listening to some history lectures and reading some stuff.  Keep in mind, I have not played the mod, so may suggest some redundant stuff.

I read a cool\sad story about a Soviet tank driver who was fighting the Germans (to their surprise) with an outdated tank... 1.... by shooting them with a pistol because the tank was outdated... 2 and was also fighting without legs.  This heroism contradicts the fighting the Germans were expecting. I mean I'm pretty sure the Germans thought it was going to be a walk in the park.  They were expecting a fight like Tannenberg where the Russian army just collapsed and fled after incurring a couple million losses. 
 
Instead Russians tended to fight with an increasing fanaticism and heroism.

So I guess when it comes to the game...

Russia spent a lot of money on tanks.  So it is safe to say that one of their specializations should be tank skills....

Maybe a skill where your tanks will come back to life briefly to fire away a few shots....

Soviet artillery is good. 

Contrary to shit you hear like "In Stalingrad, every two Soviet soldiers had a rifle and a clip." 

While this occurred, Russians were still outproducing Germans in everything by at least 50%. Meaning while they industrially outpower Germany 2 to 1, the Germans were preparing for war with Russia for awhile, while Russia... was not...

So in the game Russia should be able to make a lot more, on a lot quicker notice.

Thanks

[DarkSanches]

Soviet no often use artillery against enemy city. They wont to save historical buildings.

And Soviet people was GREAT patriots, so become guerrilla. Guerrilla was great problem fo Germany, becose they destroed 1/3 foodstuffs on enemy territory.

i not so good know English, so if something not undestend, ask me.

[vietlord]

usual russian hated usual communism ... but german army was the devil and best way to stand the devil was the red army ...

as the german doctrine was : sov are animals to execute, russian answered (as badly toward civilians)

watch alexander Nievski film !

[GodlikeDennis]

This is the Red Army Suggestion forum guys, continue this discussion in another forum or try to be a bit more constructive.

Maybe a skill where your tanks will come back to life briefly to fire away a few shots....

As far as I know, this isn't possible. When a tank dies it creates a wreck. This entity doesn't belong to any player so an ability like this wouldn't effect it. Instead, a timed ability where your tanks cannot take engine damage, main gun destroyed or the various death criticals would serve a similar purpose. It would have to be VERY short though, to not be overpowered. Something like 5-10 seconds max.

It usually looks better when you make suggestions for a mod you have actually played as well. Give it a go, it's heaps fun.

[vietlord]

Maybe a skill where your tanks will come back to life briefly to fire away a few shots....
 Instead, a timed ability where your tanks cannot take engine damage, main gun destroyed or the various death criticals would serve a similar purpose. It would have to be VERY short though, to not be overpowered. Something like 5-10 seconds max.

command n conquer red alert has that (for every tank i reckon)

it s unfair ! there is smoke support = enough

[Arthurshmitt]

Hmmm... Some notices from former SU inhabitant.
Some features of Soviet Red Army was realised incorrectly in The Eastern Front mod. For example:
- Soviet infantry can't grab wermacht weapons... WHY? There are many historical photos, where soviet soldiers held german MP-40s or StG-44s I understand, that developers made this feature to manage in-game balance. But this feature isn;t historically correct.
- Where is soviet MG teams? Red Army had a lot of machine guns (and sub-machine guns) during the war. Playing Eastern front, I felt soviet troops had only 3-linear Mosin rifles (no Mosin-Nagans! Russian original name of this rifles is "trehlineinaya vintovka Mosina..." or 3-linear Mosin rifles). For example, soviet engineers (sappers) in mod had only rifles as their primary armament. My grandfather was a sapper during GPW. And he (and his comrades) held PPSh-41 sub-machine gun. Developers, please, pay attention.
Why do some soviet troopers have one rifle for two soldiers? Excuse me, did respectable developers study GPW of SU by american movie @Enemy at the gates@? This film is trash without any hint of historical reliability. Certainly, there were problems with weapons on some places in Stalingrad. But why, more than 60 years after "Stalingrad cauldron", americans show this single cases as one giant fact (pseudofact) - soviets had no weapons and their infantry were "meat for cannons"? I think, this bug must be removed from the Mod.
-Soviet tanks. Actually, Red Army had a very little quantity of light tanks. All industrial powers of soviet tank factories had been thrown to increase production of T-34 medium tank, foundation of Soviet armoured forces. In my opinion, it will be better to except ligt tanks from mod. By the way, drawning of T-34-76 tank in game's unit window is incorrect - front MG and driver's window drawed mirrorly from original. And T-34-85 had heavier armor then T-34-76. Soviet IS-2 also had heavier frontal armor than Panzercampfwagen VI Tiger (120mm vs 100mm). BM-13-16 could fire 16 m-13 rockets in 8.5 km range.
This is my first impressions from the mod. I'm glad that developers had done so hard work to add Soviet army to COH. In some cases they did units better than Relic. I hope, that in future they will do the mod more reliable (on my PC it crashes every 10 minutes. I have rather powerfull quad-core machine with 2 gbs of RAM and 1 gb of VGA). Sorry for my agressive words and bad English.
Thanks

[Zerstörer]

We're well aware of all the historical facts(I guarantee you we know alot more than you do), but COH is NOT a hardcore historic simulation and neither is this mod.

We've heard all the above over a dosen or so times and every time we explain the same thing...so all your above historical/grandfather story telling comments are ,to say the least, irrelevant to the mod.

If you're looking for that 'historic realism', you won't find it in Vanila COH. The closest you'll get to what you're asking is when European Theater mod releases their version of the Soviets where the entire system combat system is reworked to represent realism.

Cheers

[SublimeSnugz]

Hmmm... Some notices from former SU inhabitant.
Some features of Soviet Red Army was realised incorrectly in The Eastern Front mod. For example:
- Soviet infantry can't grab wermacht weapons... WHY? There are many historical photos, where soviet soldiers held german MP-40s or StG-44s I understand, that developers made this feature to manage in-game balance. But this feature isn;t historically correct.
- Where is soviet MG teams? Red Army had a lot of machine guns (and sub-machine guns) during the war. Playing Eastern front, I felt soviet troops had only 3-linear Mosin rifles (no Mosin-Nagans! Russian original name of this rifles is "trehlineinaya vintovka Mosina..." or 3-linear Mosin rifles). For example, soviet engineers (sappers) in mod had only rifles as their primary armament. My grandfather was a sapper during GPW. And he (and his comrades) held PPSh-41 sub-machine gun. Developers, please, pay attention.
Why do some soviet troopers have one rifle for two soldiers? Excuse me, did respectable developers study GPW of SU by american movie @Enemy at the gates@? This film is trash without any hint of historical reliability. Certainly, there were problems with weapons on some places in Stalingrad. But why, more than 60 years after "Stalingrad cauldron", americans show this single cases as one giant fact (pseudofact) - soviets had no weapons and their infantry were "meat for cannons"? I think, this bug must be removed from the Mod.
-Soviet tanks. Actually, Red Army had a very little quantity of light tanks. All industrial powers of soviet tank factories had been thrown to increase production of T-34 medium tank, foundation of Soviet armoured forces. In my opinion, it will be better to except ligt tanks from mod. By the way, drawning of T-34-76 tank in game's unit window is incorrect - front MG and driver's window drawed mirrorly from original. And T-34-85 had heavier armor then T-34-76. Soviet IS-2 also had heavier frontal armor than Panzercampfwagen VI Tiger (120mm vs 100mm). BM-13-16 could fire 16 m-13 rockets in 8.5 km range.
This is my first impressions from the mod. I'm glad that developers had done so hard work to add Soviet army to COH. In some cases they did units better than Relic. I hope, that in future they will do the mod more reliable (on my PC it crashes every 10 minutes. I have rather powerfull quad-core machine with 2 gbs of RAM and 1 gb of VGA). Sorry for my agressive words and bad English.
Thanks

Hey arthurshmitt have you considered how booring and ubalanced the game would be if they implent your ideas?

COH is not a dead serious realistic ww2 simulator. having conscripts that have too few rifles is just a super cool feature from EF! ... otherwise Soviets would just be very simmilar to US or wehrmacht.

the war is over arthur ... get over it dude. 

[Tico_1990]

First of all, the original CoH isn't based on facts either, but on "saving private Ryan" and "Band of Brothers". You might have noticed that shermans are more powerful compared to their real life counterparts. Also the ranges of various units do not match that of their real life counterparts (effective tiger gun range was 1.5 km if memory serves me right and I'm sure that tigers in game do not fire these distances).

To answer some of your specific points:
The reason that soviet infantry can't grab wehrmacht heavy weapons, is because this causes a crash. It is a hardcoded problem that can not be solved without relic's help. The same will be true for the ostheer until relic fixed this. I think however that they are able to pick up light weapons (such as StG's, Bazooka's etc.

As for the lack of mg teams, I don't know exactly why that is, but the SU has good alternatives in the mod.

PPSh's and such can be equipped/upgraded by Red banner strelky. As for why engineers don't have these, that most likely has something to do with the fact that the engineers aren't meant as battlefield troops. Also, I think that sappers and engineers in real life are not exactly the same. Engineers are used to build, while sappers are primarily used to destroy enemy buildings and such.

As you might have noticed, the only unit to be equipped with 1 rifle per 2 man, are standard conscripts. After you buy the NKVD upgrade, every newly produced conscript has a rifle per man.

That the quantity of light tanks was less than that of tanks like the T34, doesn't mean they shouldn't be build-able. These light tanks for example are good replacements for the lack of an mg team. Also, following the "they weren't build as much as other tanks" method, stuff like the jagdpanther, jagdtiger, and the bergetiger shouldn't be in the game either, yet you don't make a problem out of those either. The same probably goes for the tiger, sherman calliope, and the Pershing.

As for the crashes you experience, what are you doing at that moment and which version of the mod do you use. In version 1.1 there was a common crash which happened when upgraded red banner strelky died (present version is version 1.1.1 or something like that).

To make a long story short, a number of things in game have been done to preserve balance. Some others are done for "entertainment value" (like the conscripts with 1 gun per 2 man) because that is what people recognise.
Lastly, neither the original game, nor the mod claim to be fully historically correct and they even stated that Enemy at the Gates served as a source of inspiration, even though they realise that it isn't historically correct.

I hope that this answered some of your questions.

Cheers

[Saavedra]

Jesus Christ.

We just need the British, the Americans and the Germans also whining about the obvious, "artist´s license" inaccuracies, and nobody will ever want to make a damn mod of any game ever again.