Wolverine v. Hellcat

[Trooper425]

Not sure if this belongs in general or balance...
I've tried both the M10 Wolverine and the M18 Hellcat in combat. I'm not sure which to use though. What are the technical stats of each, and what is the community's opinion on this?

[GodlikeDennis]

Hellcat is faster, has MG upgrade and ambush which increases damage and penetration for 1 shot. M10 has much better penetration as default (around double I think). M18 is usually better against PE because it can easily penetrate all their vehicle anyway, except the TDs/Panthers, and moves faster. M10 is better if you need actual anti-tank against heavy endgame Axis vehicles. I prefer the Hellcat because I'd rather use other counters for actual tanks (AT guns) and focus on fast TDs for vehicle hunting.

[Blackbishop]

Moved topic to the correct section.

[MBJrP36]

I love the Hellcat to backup Airborne. They cover their weaknesses pretty well and can exploit confusion that a good landing can bring.

[Pac-Fish]

I personally prefer the Hellcat as it has both AI and AT options and is faster which makes running over ppl easier . Besdies I think the M10 has some kind of misfire buggy

[stealthattack1]

its all up to play style, but M10 should be used to hunt down damaged Wehrmacht vehicles and PE vehicles whereas M18 is more versatile because it can soak more damage.

[Trooper425]

Thanks guys. 

[stealthattack1]

i think i speak for all of us when i say, "glad to help"

[TheVolskinator]

The hellcat has 46 sight, 1 more sight then its weapon range--it spots for itself and can cloak. The recent patch buffed the hellcat's penetration so that it's just BARELY below that of the M10. The hellcat also tends to snipe men more often with its cannon. That being said, choosing it for the .50 cal is a bad choice, as you shouldnt be getting that close to units when you can kite them, and the fact that a TANK destroyer shouldnt be trying to take out a blob of tank busters. The hellcat's almost equal penetration, ability to cloak, and ability to spot for itself without having to invest in a jeep or other unit to spot for it lends it great synergy with british FFs. The M18 also synergises well with the M8, as the mines in addition to a cloaked ambush make for a great combination. In contrast, the M10 synergises the best with the T17, because the T17 can stun targets and allow a blob of M10s to swarm in and r4p3 whatever it is. Hard. The M18 can also 'scoot shoot' with its ambush, driving up to, stopping, camoing, shooting, and resuming moving on a target, essentially getting the ambush bonus and then retaining basic mobility. Its a hard tactic, but if, say, an enemy P4 is backing away, you can drive up, camo shot it, and then resume the chase while still staying out of the P4s range. Its a tough tactic, but well worth it.

The M10 and the M18 have the same armor types and HP counts (armor_tank_destroyer; 300, respectively) with the higher accel/decel of the M10 lending it to better crushing. The Hellcats oversized model also makes it hard to crush with, and also makes its pathing abysmal. In all frankness, the Hellcat is by far the better unit (lacks the misfire bug that STILL hasnt been patched in vcoh).

[GodlikeDennis]

Not to mention penetration makes no difference if you are attacking tanks from behind, where both TDs will always penetrate anyway. The goal of both should be to swarm/flank heavier tanks.

[stealthattack1]

basically relic said to themselves, "why do we need to fix the M10 ? lets just make an irresistible reward unit."

[Jeff 'Robotnik' W.]

i think relic simply buffed it a little too much. before the last patch, it had extremely shit penetration, was slower than the m10, and basically had to rely on its ambush to even hope to acomplish anything. this latest patch also heavily nerfed the ambush ability though, justifying its stat buffs

[Pac-Fish]

Does the Hellcat gain a "first strike" bonus like fallschirmjagers?

[Jeff 'Robotnik' W.]

Yes it does, but onlh for the first shot. I dont remember the exact stats though and i dont have my computer in front of me to look them up

[TheVolskinator]

Damage 1.5
Penetration  1.5